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Discussion Starter #1
Put a new CD in the drive today - actually not new, but the re-mastered aniversary edition of Rumours (and stunning it is too)

The syatem said "Accessing Gracenotes Database" then told me "no data", so the CD played but without any CD Name or tract names. No surprise as the CD is just out and the data in the system is from the service last october.

Now we all know this data is on the CD, so why doesn't the stupidly expensive system show the deata from the CD when there isn't anything on the database and why does it need the database anyway?

Anyone know how to get the system yo use the CD data??



Edited by: jenkspj
 

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Might be wong here but firstly I do not think that most CD's carry this information, if your CD has "CD Text" designation then it does and the system should pick it up.


Secondly, I do not think that LR download the complete Gracenoted DB at service, I think instead that when you rip a CD to the hard drive, it does an over the air look-up to Gracenotes to pull downand store the track info. If you are just playing the CD, I do not think that it bothers.



I cannot believe that all CD'd do not come with track data but if you are used to importing them into iTunes or similar, you will also be familiar with the look-up that it does using the track length data to identiftythe CD in question andpull back the info.



Hope that the above is accurate and helpful.
 

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Well, my experience is different. My son is a singer/songwriter and just finished a new CD which was registered with Gracenotes. Now, he's just starting out. When I placed his CD in my computer neither iTunes nor Windows Media Player could find it on Gracenotes. But the Evoque did! Gotta be sun spots.
 

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But did the CD already have the track data on it?


It is not easy to find clear info on this but from what I have read, there is a distinct possibility that the Gracenotes DB is copied to the car, not sure what the update process is though. There is a reference to the use of Gracenotes in the manual but it states that it can either be from a stored copy or from a query against the database.



Now very interested to find out how this really works.
Edited by: scol2000
 

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No, The CD does not have notes and most now, do not (but see below). Later in the day, iTunes and Win Player did recognize the CD (WinAmp did right from the start BTW). Once the info is accessedthat data can then be stored on the computer using it.

You can actually contact Gracenotes. In fact the engineers who worked with my son just sent the data to Gracenotes. MP3 tracks can have the title attached on the CD. But CD Format is the standard and do not usually carry text.

Go here to learn more than any of us need: http://www.gracenote.com/

"CD-Text" is/was a format created by Sony but unclear how common it is today.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CD-Text

And: http://web.ncf.ca/aa571/cdtext.htm

It seems the issue is you need specific hardware to recognize it and you need to have the ability to create a CD in this format.



Edited by: scrannel
 

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Thanks Scrannel, that is really interesting. So from this we have to conclude that when you put a CD in the slot, it must do a "live" look-up in order to be able to pull the tracks back.


Next question, does it require a phone to be connected in order to do this?
 

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Thanks again, I have submitted a question on the web site asking for more details about the LR implementation, will be interesting to see what they come back with.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Thanks scol2000, really appreciate your and scrannel's help and advice.

I do wonder how the "box" in the Evoque can communicate with gracenote's database, other than over the web via a phone.
WWhen I ripped the CD into i-tuned it not only recognised the CD but gave me 2 options, the original edition of Rumours or the new 3 CD special edition.

 

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Oh Lord I must be getting old, or suffering from forum brain fade.

This has been discussed before on the forums, trouble is I can't remember where.

If I put in older CDs they get recognised by Gracenote, recently bought ones don't.

Let's hope scol2000 gets an answer.

Sooner that than I trawl through thousands of threads
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Just tried the Rumours CD in the E350 Coupe, the car had a service, including "Command" update earlier this week.
No surprise, the CD wasn't recognised.

I'm beginning to think that the iPod/Phone makes the CD installation in any car redundant. All it needs is a single DVD player, perhaps.
 

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Had a reply to my email from Gracenotes but looks as though we may need to unleash Liam from LR on this one.....

"Thanks for writing. Although Gracenote has been delivering solutions in the automotive market since 2001, each car company has a slightly different strategy for helping their customers and distributing database updates to their customers. The place to ask about service, technical manuals and the latest updates is at your local dealership.

The way this works is that the automaker has their own development department that built a product that's licensed to use our recognition technology. They have signed a contract with Gracenote so that we can provide them recognition technology and updates.

We are a business-to-business technology company. We then provide the car company updates at regular intervals according to their contract, and they distribute updates to their consumers (that would be you). Because I'm not familiar with the product in your vehicle, and don't have any technical manuals, I'm at a disadvantage here.

If your own dealer is not helpful, the headquarters should be able to easily answer your questions. They would best know how the car manufacturer is providing information and updates for you - their customer."
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Indeed!

The question is how do we get a Gracenotes database update from JLR and is if FOC? Should be!
Mercedes sat nav and gracenotes databases are FOC updates for 3 years, then it is well over £150 a year.

Interestingly the HK Dolby 5.1 Demo disk from Mercedes was recognised by the Evoque Gracenotes database and all track information is 100% correct!
 

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Well, I believe we are using an internet connect with the car. Have a look at this link:

http://www.mnn.com/green-tech/transportation/blogs/why-your-car-cant-read-your-cd-tracks

Yes, while many cars do include a data base that can be updated, I believe many of the newest are using internet. Again, my son finished his new CD just a couple weeks before I took delivery of my Evoque (and he took delivery of a new Jeep Cherokee, BTW). When we put in his new CD (which had JUST been added to Gracenote) both cars recognized the CD w/o issue.
 

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I put a 1980's CD in my Evoque & it displayed all the tracks etc but when we were away last Summer I bought a new Club Music CD & got no information. I thaught this very odd!
Then again I had no idea what it meant by accessing Gracenotes Database ( & still don't).
Edited by: The Valeter
 

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The Valeter said:
I put a 1980's CD in my Evoque & it displayed all the tracks etc but when we were away last Summer I bought a new Club Music CD & got no information. I thaught this very odd!
Then again I had no idea what it meant by accessing Gracenotes Database ( & still don't).
Gracenote is a company in California with a database of CDs. The idea is if you put a CD in your computer (iTunes, etc.) will access that database online looking for a match. Which it will then display on your computer. Remember, back in "yee olde days" not only was no one playing CDs on a computer, but when you put your CD in a player (stand alone, car etc.) they did not yet have the ability to display any info. So, having info on the CD cover alone was enough.

Now people using computers had a problem -- unless it was MP3 or something -- you could not attach track info. Thus the advent of Gracenote (not the only one BTW). Earlier cars could only do this through a stored database (on the car's gear) which would need to be updated, But now, as I'm reading these articles (and seems from experience) many vehicles can go on line and access the data base. Just like they do traffic info etc.

Edited by: scrannel
 

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So Liam from LR did some research on our behalf:


His Tech's advised that ...



"The Gracenote system on Land Rover vehicles is stored on an on board database".


<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">"The Gracenote system is not up datable on the Land Rover infotainment system".

<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">

<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">I challenged this, my thinking beingthat it made no sense for it to just become more and more out of date over time but that is exactly what LR are saying. Even if LR are too tightto include anannual update at service, they could at least offer it as a cost option. Clearly a decision made by the bean counters,

<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">

<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">In reality, most of us will probably stop playing CD's in the car before this really becomes a material issue which begs the question, why bother in the first place.

<DIV style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">

Edited by: scol2000
 

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scol2000 said:
So Liam from LR did some research on our behalf:


His Tech's advised that ...



"The Gracenote system on Land Rover vehicles is stored on an on board database".


<div style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">"The Gracenote system is not up datable on the Land Rover infotainment system".

<div style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">

<div style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">I challenged this, my thinking beingthat it made no sense for it to just become more and more out of date over time but that is exactly what LR are saying. Even if LR are too tightto include anannual update at service, they could at least offer it as a cost option. Clearly a decision made by the bean counters,

<div style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">

<div style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">In reality, most of us will probably stop playing CD's in the car before this really becomes a material issue which begs the question, why bother in the first place.

<div style="FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: arial, sans-serif">
This is right and wrong. First of all, cars can access Gracenote database via internet. This must be how the evoque does as, I mentioned earlier, my son had just entered his new CD in Gracenote and two days later I put his CD in the car, it went to Gracenote and found it. I had done no database upgrade on the new car, obviously. However, I believe once the CD is recognized it may be stored in an on-board database.

I would suggest this is your dealer blowing you off.

I have a call into Gracenote public relations (they're here in California) and will see if I can sort and report back! (Meanwhile an article written in 2012 about cars and internet connection):

"The drawback of the latter option (database in the car) is plain, since hundreds if not
thousands of CDs are released every week and the database goes instantly
out of date. White says that Ford and GM, as well as Audi, are
pioneering the best connected systems today, though MyFord Touch has its
issues. The state of the art is the Tesla Model S sedan, which has an
always-on Internet connection and so reliably gathers track names and
album art."



Edited by: scrannel
 

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Hi Scrannel,


My reply was from the the Technical team at LR HQ, not from the dealer. I have also contacted Gracenotes but they could not provide specific info on the Evoque or LR products generally.



I still think that the CD that you used was already encoded with the track names, if LR are correct, that is pretty much the only other explanation. Guess the only way to find out for certain is to buy a newly released commercial CD and try it in the car (or burn another copy of your son's CD and do not include Data when burning it).



When I have played CD's, the track info is returnednear instantly which suggests to me that it cannot be doing an on-line look-up and it works regardless of my phone being connected too.



Happy to be proven wrong and I would prefer any answer to the one that I have been provided by LR.








Edited by: scol2000
 

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Track encoding is not and has not been used for years. It was created by Sony -- but can only be encoded by specific machine and READ by dedicated machines. Sony now owns Gracenote. As you can see by the quote I supplied, most cars today -- and they mention Ford specifically -- use internet. The CD I used was not encoded as we produced the CD ourselves. There is no other data on the CD. If you do a search you'll see internet connection to Gracenote is becoming very common. But... hey, if your LR Tech guy told, then it must be true.
 
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